Sanskrit Univ: BJP's facade of righteousness?

What do you do if you have Rs. 200 crores in your hands? Well, the govt. of Karnataka has earmarked that sum to refurbish Hampi and build a Sanskrit University. Reports the DNA today:
The BJP Government of Karnataka has ticked two of its top poll promises with the sanctioning of Rs.200 Crore for refurbishing the historic ruins at Hampi and initiating steps for establishing a Sanskrit University.

It was the Tourism Minister G Janardhan Reddy who announced the government decision for Hampi's development while Minister for Higher Education Arvind Limbavali revealed on Thursday the government's intention to set up the state's first Sanskrit University. The proposed Sanskrit University will undertake research on topics related to spiritual, religious and cultural fields besides inculcating moral values among the youth, the Minister said.

While the move to refurbish the historic ruins at Hampi is a welcome one, we humbly ask: why the Sanskrit University? What topics related to "spiritual, religious and cultural fields" still exist in Sanskrit which haven't been researched till now? Really, there is nothing of any consequence which still remains un-researched in Sanskrit, and which can magically turn Karnataka into a Raama Raajya! We therefore argue that that money is better utilized if the government were to recognize the need to "refurbish the ruins" of the Hampi Kannada University which is badly in need of funds. The Hampi Kannada University must be vested with more responsibilities - such as research on science and technology in Kannada (as opposed to just research of Kannada).

The government has obviously forgotten that Purandara Dasaru who lived in Hampi (and in whose name we have the Purandara Mantapa in Hampi even today) taught spiritual truths in Kannada and not Sanskrit. While the great saint realized in as early as the 16th century that any spiritual, religious or cultural work needs to be done in the Kannada language here in Kannada Nadu, the government of Karnataka obviously lacks this basic commonsense.

One even questions whether the governement has any clue as to what the granting of Classical Language status to Kannada means, even after the cheap drama of Mr. Yeddyurappa claiming that it all happened because he threatened to stage one single demonstration in Delhi! Mr. Yeddyurappa, the declaration of Kannada as a Classical Language means, first of all, that Kannada has a literary tradition which has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with Sanskrit. Yes, n-o-t-h-i-n-g to do with Sanskrit.

Then why this Sanskrit University? Is it BJP's facade of righteousness and spiritual cleanliness in exploitation of the fact that Karnataka has forgotten the difference between Sanskrit and spirituality? What do we have upcoming next, a Pali University to put up a facade of care for underprivileged converts to Buddhism? That crap is not what Karnataka needs. What Karnataka needs today is real universities which take up education and research in Kannada as seriously as the Hebrew University of Jerusalem does in Hebrew.

24 comments:

shashi patil said...

thunderous !!!!

Great job !

Harisha said...

Hi,

I was present in the first meeting /conference held for 3 days.And on the third day Prof.Mallepuram , the officer appointed for this new university spoke.
His idea is in to integrate Kannada learning and sankrit.But here I found no satisfying answers in the imp meet.

Interestingly most of those assembled were MA, Vidwans in Sanskrit and the points they raised were not like- how to bring fresh air to Sanskrit learning?how to blend it to modern day requiremnts.Not that they were too traditional to look in to the matter as they even never bothered to discuss on maintaining the classical ways of protecting sanskrit learning!!

Then what did they do?The typical questions asked were: how to get jobs for MA, Vidwans in Sanskrit?
How to merge the existing sanskrit independent institutes in the umbrella of the new university?

Means it is going to be one more university to nurture ' white elephants' line same old non sense scholatic writings typically found in most of the universities related to Hindi, Malayalam, urdu, History, and of course Kannada!!

This is because Prof.mallepuram hassame ideas as the founders of Hapmi university and he was one of the chief ofices who were back bone of it since the formation days.

ರಾಜ್ said...

The move to refurbish Hampi is certainly welcome! But a Sanskrit University??? As you rightly pointed out, since Kannada is a classical language, it has an independent, long and continuous tradition and nothing to do with Sanskrit! Why should the government of Karnataka forget its own living classical language and spend funds for another classical language that gets a huge amount of funds from the central government??? If anything, the need of the hour is a Kannada University! Or the money can be spent on establishing Kannada organisations in other countries. Or it can be used to encourage writers who struggle to earn a decent income because they write in Kannada. There is absolutely no need to spend the money on Sanskrit instead of Kannada!

Suveer Nagendra said...

Please do not get delirious in your love for Kannada. I think we all agree that Kannada is a very old language and needs to be preserved.
I wonder how many of Sanskrit works the author of the article has read to say that "All Sanskrit works are researched". Please understand that its impossible to translate Sanskrit to any other language simply because no other language is as advanced as Sanskrit.
Just tell me in how many ways can you translate the word "Agni" is Kannada ? Agni = Fire / benki. Then what ?

The etymology of the word Agni lies ONLY in Sanskrit and NOT in any other language. It translates to "The one that can move the stagnant". I hope the readers of this will appreciate the "Science" that is behind one single word.

Now imagine what a great loss it will be to Humanity if Sanskrit is not researched and LOST.

See languages in light of their merit.

Jockey said...

@ Suveer Nagendra,

1)
First, learn how to read carefully before writing. The author never said "All Sanskrit works are researched". Here's what was said:

What topics related to "spiritual, religious and cultural fields" still exist in Sanskrit which haven't been researched till now?

Don't see the difference? Well, go get an English grammar book first.

If you think there are any topics related to "spiritual, religious and cultural fields" which haven't been researched till now, quote those topics instead of making blanket statements.

2)
Your claim that no language is as advanced as Sanskrit is baseless. First define what "advancement" is. Bloody hell, Sanskrit is so underdeveloped that there are no speakers of that language! Languages are meant to be spoken and written and communicated using. If Sanskrit doesn't serve that basic purpose, God save you who thinks it's an "advanced" language.

Perhaps you mean that all Sanskrit words have clearly defined root forms? That doesn't make it advanced, dude! Words in languages need not be derivable from roots. In fact, words in languages are basically random. Read "Course in General Linguistics" by Ferdinand de Saussure, and you'll know what's being talked about here. There is no reason your pet "Agni" has to be called "Agni". It's only popular usage which limits people (assuming there are atleast a few who speak Sanskrit) from calling "Agni" as "Aapah".

So if you're thinking there are some basic scientific truths which necessitate Sanskrit words to be what they are, there would no no one more stupid than you. Sanskrit is no different from other languages here.

3)
The meaning "The one that can move the stagnant" does not exist in the word "Agni". It is imposed on it. It could similarly be imposed on the Kannada word "Benki" or the English "Fire". Hey, you know what? You just did that!

It's nonsense to think that there is any science behind the word "Agni". There is no science behind "Agni". The science is in the head of those great thinkers who imposed the above mentioned meaning on it. And those thinkers are all dead. And the works of all those thinkers have been translated to Kannada. There is nothing else remaining.

4)
It's you who needs to see languages in light of their merits. It's you who are seeing Sanskrit beyond its merit - which is nothing but the body of spiritual literature which exists in it. Usually, those who don't have what it takes to eat the banana are the ones who describe the beauty of the peel. Here, the banana is the spiritual knowledge and the peel is the language - Sanskrit. Question yourself whether you're focusing more on the banana or the peel.

Suveer Nagendra said...

I see that Jockey is totally ignorant of what a language means and is devoid of the capacity to think.
If you are really interested to know the many meanings of the word "Agni" and the Etymological origins of the word and the words in Sanskrit I suggest you go through the Sayana Bhashya of the vedic literature.

What a pity that people in this country do not read or try to understand their own literature or language.

And what an unscientific bent of mind to say "There is no science behind Agni".

R said...

Jockey,
About your Q "What topics related to "spiritual, religious and cultural fields" still exist in Sanskrit which haven't been researched till now?"

Have you heard of Aryan Invasion debate?? It is only in sanskrit that we can get into the roots of the debate - because its part if the indian civilization & we will have to by all means preserve it. Note that u dont have a civilization called Karnataka/kannada civilization do you? Or perhaps u r bent upon fabricating one.
If u r a worm inside the banana - u will never realize what is the skin & what is the fruit.

Jockey said...

@ Suveer Nagendra

You make the same mistake again, dude. You don't read. You only write. I've addressed each of your questions; just read them before you write crap.

And just calling me names doesn't amount to arguing your viewpoint.

Looks like there's no point replying to you (because you don't read), but let me say this anyway:

Show that you've got real stuff in between your ears by coming up with a list of topics which exist in Sanskrit literature, but which haven't been already researched on.

If you reply, reply with that list. Or don't. Then I'll understand what lies in between your ears.

And for your Agni stuff - my point is: all those meanings of Agni have been researched and have already been translated to Kannada. If not, speak up. If yes, shut up.

@ R

Dude, I like your worm stuff. I'm atleast a worm inside the banana. Suveer Nagendra is a worm on the peel :-) Joking...:-)

Seriously, I think the Aryan Invasion Theory is crap. I don't believe people invaded India like that. But that is besides the point. That is besides the discussion going on here. Talk to the point, not around it.

sandhya said...

@R

Would like to answer you about your concern that there did not exist a "Karnataka/Kannada civilization". You are actually wrong. There are places like SaroTagi and BoodihaaLa in Karnataka/Maharashtra border which is said to have had civilizations similar to tht in Harappa/Mohenjodaro. It had a fully developed place to manufacture metallic weapons. Also Sarotagi is said to have had an university similar to that in NaLanda. Actually the truth is not enough research has ever been done in Southren India. Also do you know about remnants of old civilization along the Tungabhadra river? Please try to find out about this.
Do you think people here were still swinging from trees to trees down south when there was a civilization upto Gujrat? Have you ever noticed that Mahabharatha actually mentions a place call "Karnata desha"? Please think about it.... And the biggest irony about our history books today is that they are all so full of "national history"--> meaning north Indian history. We south Indians learn about Jhansi Rani. Have you heard of a north Indian who has learnt about Kittur Rani Chennamma or Abbakka?

Jai Veerupaksha said...

If a language cannot help in the upliftment of the masses and is intended to be restricted to a select few....it will meet the same fate as Sanskrit.Unless the essence of the Bhagavad Geete is disseminated to the teeming millions of the country in a language that they understand it is as good as non existent and only of academic interest.Contrast it to say Thirukurral which is as old but it has become so much of an Aadu Bhaashe..that most Tamilians refer to it as the Bible while the Geeta was also intended to serve the purpose.

Also if Sanskrit has such a wide reach, one could have left it to the centre which has also declared Sanskrit as a classical language to do the spending related to Research. Will the centre refund Karnataka for such acts of Philanthropy or the so called "Larger Good". On the contrary, KA will have to go with a begging bowl to get the release of 300 cr that is due it annually for development and promotion of Kannada.

I don't know why Kannadigas are so suicidal and so also the Government of KA?? Before clearing the mess in our respective areas, our state our language, we seem to be too bothered about the world at large.Unfortunately in this context , BJP's undue importance to Sanskrit and its silence on Hindi imposition will prove to be costly mistakes for its political future in KA

I have nothing against Sanskrit as a language( objectively) but such an announcement in the land of Krishnadevaraya, (who was a great patron of other languages but he ventured into all this patronising from a position of strength for Kannada where there was never a threat to its hegemony in the Vijayanagara Saamrajya) clearly shows that our leaders have never truely understood what actual leadership is.

We are the greatest split personalities of the world.....Period

maaysa said...

@Jockey

Aryan Invasion theory has too many good rational arguments in its support( whether YOU believe or not if doesn't matter). If you read more you may get convinced.

@Sanskrit Folks.
There is no word for ’ಬಾಯಿ’ in Sanskrit. ವದನ etc.. also mean face. Hence my medical books written in Sanskrit face problem and use word ವದನದ್ವಾರ(door of face). There are a lot of words which Sanskrit borrowed from Dravidian languages like ಚಂದ್ರ, ಗಾರ್ದಭ, ಕುಕ್ಕುರ, ವಲ್ಲಿ etc etc. [more info can be found in Emeanu and Burrow Dravidian etymology dictionary]

And gender system and ಉಪಸರ್ಗ in Sanskrit is nasty. ದಾರಃ means wife but it is ಪುಲ್ಲಿಂಗ.

Sanskrit has enough draw backs. even to say 'ಬರುತ್ತಾಳೆ', Sanskrit has to do lots circus because ಸಾ ಆಗಚ್ಛತಿ, ಸಃ ಆಗಚ್ಛತಿ, ತತ್ ಆಗಚ್ಛತಿ all can mean 'ಬಂದಳು’. Where as one Kannada word 'ಬಂದಳು’ informs gender, number, tense and verb, totally 4 information. Sanskrit has so many ಲಕಾರs for what? All u need to mug and mug the rules with no logic.

Sanskrit gender system is so haphazard and confusing and illogical. English is better than is in some sense.

When it comes to structure of the language Dravidian languages are solid. They have very good verb forms, sentence formations and easy to understand, simple and effective grammar rules. Though they suffer when it comes make nouns.

You are too partial, may be the lack of knowledge about the Dravidian languages( Kannada, Tamil etc) or its the Sanskrit fanaticism of false claim that all languages are from Sanskrit.

If Sanskrit was really divine if wouldn't have died and none speaks it today. ya.. I know u may quote about a village of some 1000 people(even their mother tongue is a kind of Tamilish Kannada) but compare to Kannada which 4crore and odd speakers its so inferior.

A language is great when it is useful more and more people, not because some self proclaimed people keep shouting false claim about it. Check you statistics, Kannada clearly is greater that Sanskrit which show all the phases and progress of a living language. All the old, medieval and modern varieties of Kannada show its liveliness. And the Sanskrit is stuck and dead in some BC Panini grammar.

Like majority of Indo-European languages Sanskrit must be suffering from 'ನೀನು ನಿಮ್ಮನ ಎಷ್ಟನೇ ಮಗ’ drawback, otherwise it 100% borrowed from Dravidian languages.

And I laugh at Agni example. Check how Kannada word 'ಒಗ್ಗರಣೆ’ has come. :)

Clangorous said...

@ Suveer Nagendra,
As you have mentioned :

'What a pity that people in this country do not read or try to understand their own literature or language'

We would prefer to understand our own literature or langauge which is Kannada and not an extinct language like Sanskrit... . As Sandhya has rightly mentioned archaeological evidence proves that the civilisation on the banks of Tungabhadra as one of the oldest..

For all the Sanskrit fanboys... I am sure most of you havent even heard of this great work by a Jain poet/saint Kumudendu Muni called 'Siri Bhoovalaya'. No one has been able to decipher encoded information in this work completely. How many of our own Kannadigas know that such an advance form of literature exisits in Kannada that too written only with Kannada Numerals encompassing 718 languages of the world... ?

Please refer the link below for more information about it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siribhoovalaya
http://www.virtuescience.com/siribhoovalaya.html

I would want Karnataka Government to spend funds on such a masterpiece which even todays so called 'Brainy' Techies/Programmers may find it very challenging to decipher.

Its high time Kannadigas come out of their blind slavery to Sanskrit/Hindi and be proud of their own literature which is much more advanced and truly global.

R said...

Hi,
I must confess I did not know anything on SaroTagi and BoodihaaLa. No results in google as well. Is there any book available on it? Can u throw some light on where I could get it? What period was it in?
Is this info so obscure that no one in the world has ever come forward to put this info on net?

Yet the earliest kannada inscriptions found are around 950 AD only (Harappa is far too earlier period) - which means to say that People from the north migrated here.
So essentially our civilization is Indian(Hindustan is rather more appropriate as the name India is only after greeks invaded) in nature & not Karnataka's.
Why are you bent upon seperating Karnataka from India?

Clangorous said...

@ R ,
No one is trying to seperate Karnataka from India/Bharatha/Hindustan... Funds meant to be used for the upliftment of the language of the land should not be re-directed to a langauge which most people hardly comprehend... I am sure even most of the so called superior Aryan descendants (read north indians) can hardly comprehend Sanskrit. When even Central Government is misusing tax payer's money in millions to impose hindi on non-hindians ... why should karnataka fund a Sanskrit University ignoring our very own Hampi Kannada University ?...As the author has rightly mentioned its nothing but BJP's blind imposition of Sanskrit and cunningly Hindi from back door..

maaysa said...

@Clangorous
Good Job. ಕರ್ಣಾಟ ಸಿರಿಭೂವಲಯ is an amazing work. It explains how Kannada alphabets and digits are created. It says Jains considered/consider Kannada as a divine language. Rishabha deva the first Theerthankara is the one who gifted Kannada alphabets and digits.

@Karnatique
Please write an article about Siribhoovalaya. Its an amazing work in Kannada.

sandhya said...

@R:

I had read about BoodihaLa long time back. Definitely theres nothing on internet about it. Even without them, there is nothing to prove your argument of "people from north migrated to south and south had no civilization".
If the Greek plays dating to Alexander's time can contain whole dialogues in Kannada, definitely, it could not have come up in 200 hundred years. All I say here is that more research needs to be done down south.

@Maaysa

truly Siribhoovalaya is an amazing work. If you have read the way that book has been treated, you will realize that the attitude of Kannadigas towards their own treasure has been so bad from so long. If this work was to be found any where else in world, it would have been researched and studied and publicised from all possible angles.

R said...

I believe u have misunderstood me. Though I told I was not aware of the BoodihaLa civilization - By no means does it indicate that there has been no migration.
It has been proved that The people of Africa have migrated to india - let alone people of north india to the south. Refer: Spencer Wells, The Journey of Man: A Genetic Odyssey.
Also see the documentary - the story of india By Michael wood.

The mtDNA ( M-132 to be specific ) - origin of African tribe has been traced to a village in Tamil nadu near madurai. U can find more details in the documentary I specified.
U will only then find ur blind belief/faith ebbing away.

sandhya said...

@R:

ur words are contradicting. U say "The people of Africa have migrated to india" and you also say "origin of African tribe has been traced to a village in Tamil nadu near madurai"... :)

R said...

Of course what I told is correct - U have misunderstood it.
M132 gene is a gene of African origin.
This gene has been found in a tribe in Tamil Nadu - Which means to say that these people were the earliest "indians" who migrated from Africa.
Prof Pachaiyappan (Madurai Kamaraj university) has done extensive research on it - this is also shown in the documentary I mentioned about.

It seems u r arguing for the sake of the same...

Sandhya said...

@R

We can just keep arguing... any ways I do not believe much in the "Aryan Invasion theory".. if really Europeans had invaded India, there should have been so many blondes, red haired ppl , blue eyed ppl etc etc... however we cant find any.... moreover from all things that you poit out, including that Africa is the origin for human race, first ppl migrated from there to every where... one still cannot prove that there were no ppl in south India when there was a civilization in north.. I rest at this :)

priya said...

The Aryan invasion theory (AIT) or its opposition doesn't prove or disprove anything.
A thought from Purohita from Singapore:
http://purohita.blogspot.com/2007/01/aryan-invasion-theory-or-not-dravidian.html.

It is foolish to forget clear and present differences in the languages of South and North India. Whether AIT is right or wrong, the linguistic fact that South Indian languages are markedly different from North Indian languages does not get disproved! Surely this didn't come about because of the British! So - as far as our philosophy of India is concerned, the AIT is powerless in proving or disproving anything. All I say is - "There is undeniable linguistic proof that the languages of South and North India belong to two different families, and undeniable linguistic proof that Kannada is markedly different from other South Indian languages also. Period.

maaysa said...

Priya is correct.. There is not question about the two different language families.

Still some ignorant may say that all Indian language are from a Single language

kannadaclub said...

Dear commentators:
It is indeed a pity and a sorry picture to see all of you relishing the words to brutalize each other…in spite of the fact that all of you have your viewpoints that are valid for discussion….that is, if only all of you can engage in a sane, civilized, refined, and urbane way of exchanges to express yourselves.
Kannada has its place; Sanskrit has its place too. The love of Kannada and Sanskrit need not be mutually exclusive, but complementary. Sanskrit is a scientifically structured language, and was never meant for use like Pali, which was the language for day-to-day use….
In any case, the value of your comments is being put down by your own sarcastic, disparaging, and cynical tones and language.

Kannadaclub
Texas, USA

Debater said...

Suveer Nagendra,

"Now imagine what a great loss it will be to Humanity if Sanskrit is not researched and LOST.

See languages in light of their merit."

All that is being said is that it is the Central Government's responsibility to promote Sanskrit as it is a Pan-Indian Language and not the responsibility of the Karnataka Government. The Linguistic Organisation of the states took place to ensure the survival and growth of different languages and their associated cultures.

Let all states contribute a portion of their incomes for the growth of sanskrit and not just KRN.

KRN Government should be primarily concerned with the growth of kannada and not Sanskrit(to the exclusion of kannada).

Let all states contribute to the growth of Sanskrit and not just KRN is all I am saying!

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